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How do you reconcile problems when selling ethically and making goal are not in alignment?

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Michael A Brown
President, BtoBEngage
Posted on Jan. 9, 2012

Hi Andrew. There is no reconciliation with illegal or unethical sales behavior. Don’t go to jail for anyone. Don’t do anything you could not explain with pride to your children. Don’t do anything that would cause you to say, “I would never do that again.”

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Andrew Rudin
Andrew Rudin Replied on Jan. 16, 2012

Hi Michael: I like your answer, though I don't want to confuse 'illegal,' and 'unethical.' There are plenty of things people do that are unquestionably legal, but questionably ethical. So I think your recommendation not to do anything that you could not explain with pride to your children, or that couldn't pass a basic litmus test for 'is this the right thing to do?' are excellent guideposts for salespeople.

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Jason Cheverton
Branch Manager, CTE Solutions Inc
Posted on Jan. 9, 2012

The challenge here, as it pertains to sales, is the undeniable fact that there is always someone willing to do what most won't - which can create an almost self justifying way of pushing past your own moral boundaries based on the premise "If I don't, someone else will". To echo John's point, I beleive it is up to the individual to determine what he/she deems as ethically acceptable since everyone's position on this is different. That being said, and as Michael pointed out, there is a fine line between ethical issues and legal limitations - the latter should never be considered.

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Jacques Werth
President, High Probability Selling
Posted on Jan. 12, 2012

If your standards require that you only do business with people that you trust and respect, you will be driven to treat your prospects and customers the same way. You will tell the truth to your prospects rather than allow your ethical standards to be compromised. If that results in losing your job, so be it.

Honest and effective salespeople are in demand. If you know how to prospect and sell, it is easy to find a really good sales job.

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Dave  Brock
Dave Brock Replied on Jan. 13, 2012

Jacques: I really like your view (as I do the others). We have to be true to our values and ethics. We can never violate those--they erode us as people--and erode our ability to deal effectively with our customers. That being said, there are consequences to everything we do. If we lose our jobs as a result, we have to own it. If we don't lose our jobs but are asked to compromise our values, we should quit. We are most effective where are values are aligned with those of our employer, the people we work with, and out customers.

Life's too short to do anything else! Thanks Jacques!

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Andrew Rudin
Andrew Rudin Replied on Jan. 16, 2012

Dave: I agree with your answer and that if the pressure to make goal compromises our personal integrity or sense of ethics, we should quit. But this isn't equally possible for everyone. One salesperson might have a cash cushion, while another might be a single parent supporting young children and an elderly parent. When faced with the same or similar choice, could they both be held to the same standard for ethical idealism? What about if the salesperson weren't unethical, but he or she was faced with whether to expose the unethical behavior of a close colleague who was experiencing financial difficulty. We have faced the same challenge with the University of Virginia Honor Code. Yes, cheating is cheating, but many students when surveyed, said they would not be inclined to turn in a fellow student because of the draconian outcome if found guilty--expulsion. So in that sense, the "black and white" interpretation becomes counterproductive.

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Alex Shootman
Chief Revenue Officer, Eloqua
Posted on Jan. 13, 2012

Andrew - I have read the other four answers and so I am probably driving the nail through the 2x4 but I see no reconciliation. It has to be a both/and not an either or. Inside our company we live by 'culture eats strategy'. Our sales culture is Getting it Done and Doing it Right (GID & DIR).

There is quite a bit of detail behind this that I won't bore you with, but essentially we say to our folks, "If you are not GID and not DIR you won't be here after a while". We go on to say, "If you are DIR but not GID we are going to coach you really hard because you have the right character. If you are both GID and DIR you are a star and we are going to hold you up as an example"

But we are very clear, if you are GID but not DIR you will be fired faster than anyone else in the organization and we have walked the talk.

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Dave  Brock
Dave Brock Replied on Jan. 13, 2012

Alex-- you have SICO--Stated It Crisply and Outstandingly---sorry, it's Friday afternoon, I just couldn't restrain myself ;-)

But seriously, your point is critical, not just from an ethics and values point of view, but in general. Too often we focus on results only and not the way to produce results. The only way to sustain anything, whether ethics, values, performance is to focus both on GID and DIR.

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Ellen Bristol
President, Bristol Strategy Group
Posted on Jan. 17, 2012

Lots of great answers but not enough focus on management. It's pretty tough for a sales representative to maintain ethical standards when the culture or metrics or corporate values violate them, just like it's nearly impossible to produce great teamwork simply by exhorting your team to play nice together. In my many years of selling, the issues around ethics were flexible at best and sometimes absolutely forbidden at worst. It was more common to have performance standards that were entirely focused on end-of-quarter numbers only; while the rules of engagement said "follow these rules at all costs! Unless you're going to miss your number, in which case BREAK the rules!!!"

Wouldn't it be great if sales professionals could understand their own ethical standards before taking the job, and if sales recruiters and hiring managers could represent the corporate values and metrics of the company honestly during the interview process.

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Robert Winslow
President, Digital Detection Corporation
Posted on Jan. 17, 2012

Hypothically, of course, your customer says to break your invoice up into two bills so he can stay under his spending limit for a single order. Is this ethical behavior? You are taking an action specifically to get around procedures against such action but who amoung us hasn't done this? Do you instead say, sorry I can't accept this sale?

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Jacques Werth
Jacques Werth Replied on Jan. 18, 2012

Order-splitting and invoice-splitting are common in many organizations.I don't think it is unethical or immoral. You are not responsible for that kind of action by your customers unless there is a law against what they are doing.

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John Anderson
Principal, The Glowan Consulting Group
Posted on Jan. 9, 2012
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I believe everyone must make their own decision based on their core values. For some, situational ethics seem to apply while for others, there just some things they will not do.

I would recommend that anyone caught in this situation should have a heart to heart with their manager and then decide what they must do. If they are really asked to do unethical things just to "make the numbers", then I recommend getting another job.

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Dennis Hogan
Owner, Pro-Line Embroidery
Posted on Jan. 15, 2012
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There are no grounds on which anyone should act unethically, but we all know people do. Therefore it is a issue that people must deal with, so the question is legitimate. I submit that raising and discussing the issue may prevent someone from doing something unethical in the future.

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Robert Winslow
President, Digital Detection Corporation
Posted on Jan. 15, 2012
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I once resigned from a very high paying position when I learned about certain "improprieties" that were taking place at the highest level of the company. I started my own company which, after several years of sacrifice, has been marginally successful. I have never achieved the income stability I gave up which contributed to a host of other issues which needed to be "reconciled".

This IS a valid post and discussing it can be helpful to those who have yet to experience it. Unethical behavior (at least in the Construction Industry) is far more common than most believe. Those whose core values are continuously adjusted in the pursuit of riches will always be around. Learn how to spot them, then learn how to aviod them.

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Andrew Rudin
Managing Principal, Outside Technologies, Inc.
Posted on Jan. 16, 2012
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Thanks for taking the time to post your ideas. The range of attitudes in the responses is interesting. I think for some people, good ethics are a black-and-white issue. That is, there are crisp boundaries that must not be violated.

Clarity is great, but I find that most of the salespeople I work with have encountered situations where ethical choices are subject to interpretation, and "right" and "wrong" are not obvious. Of great concern to me are situations in which management places great pressure on salespeople to make quota, without recognizing (or caring) about the possibility of ethical dilemmas. There are many examples. Companies that are effective in risk management have brought ethics to the forefront in sales meetings, and have enabled candid discussion. Equally important, executives have considered how to keep sales objectives and ethical behavior in concordance. It doesn't happen by coincidence.

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Robert Winslow
Robert Winslow Replied on Jan. 16, 2012

Andrew - Something you said has struck a small nerve. I set sales quotas based on the margin needed to justify a salesmans cost and contribution. I recognize (and care) that the salesman will need to properly manage ethical dilemmas. That being said, I expect the salesman to achieve his quota using ethical practices. If a salesman doesn't meet quota then that salesman is not covering their costs. You seem to be suggesting that if a salesman doesn't meet quota because they are highly ethical then that would be OK. It's clearly NOT OK and the reason is not "ethics" or lack thereof it's performance. I don't pressure my sales people to "make quota" because they are all adults and understand what their purpose in the organization is. It's to generate enough sales (ethically) to contribute enough overhead and profit to pay the bills. As long as my profit expectations are in line with the industry the only pressure on my sales force is what they create for themselves. I would agree it IS very much my responsibility to clearly state Corporate Policy regarding the use of purely ethical sales tactics.

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Andrew Rudin
Andrew Rudin Replied on Jan. 16, 2012

Robert: thanks for your comment. I don't intend to suggest that it's OK not to make quota, only to recognize that achieving quota and selling ethically are sometimes incongruent. From what you have described, you understand the nuances and you have taken steps to address situations in which your sales force could be conflicted in selling. For example, do I 'make the sale' and satisfy employer and shareholder needs, and generate a commission for myself, or do I share information with my prospect that he or she didn't request, but would be instrumental in their decision-making process and could jeopardize my sale? All parties have different--and legitimate--interests.

The greatest risk occurs when senior executives believe that ethical problems couldn't happen at their company, or when they believe the answers are black and white. In the case of deliberate theft, they are. But the overwhelming majority of business decisions are not governed by specific laws or regulations in the commercial code. There's a great danger when executives don't understand the logical pairing of the words 'ethical' and 'choice,' and think that the answers are simple, or that ethical dilemmas don't (or shouldn't) occur. They can, and they do.

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Belldon Colme
Belldon Colme Replied on Jan. 17, 2012

Robert is absolutely correct. IF a manager directs a sales person to meet quota at all costs, ethics might become an issue where the employee must decide if they are working for the right firm. However, IF a quota is set, everyone knows what the expectation is, and it is the sales person who is creating their own conflict due to under-performance, then the sales person may be becoming a liability to their employer.

BC

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Alex Dail
Founder/Owner, RightMoves
Posted on Jan. 16, 2012
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You have to answer two questions:

Are you in the world for what you can get or give? The best sales people are interested in giving value.
Ought you be unethical that good may come of it? This generally is a short term gain followed by long term pain.

Stay hungry for excellence,

Alex

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Soumik Ganguly
V.P - Global Sales and Marketing, Inzane Labs Pvt Ltd
Posted on Jan. 17, 2012
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In case Selling ethically is not alligned with achieving your sales goal, then you are dealing with the wrong set of people and I don't believe its worth anything to go ahead and crack the deal. The conversations and the behavior post the finalization of the deal will be really bad. So there is no reconciling.

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Belldon Colme
Owner, Human Nature Management
Posted on Jan. 17, 2012
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Andrew, this question becomes two very different animals depending upon whether it is asked by the sales person or their employer.

More clearly, is a salesperson being DIRECTED to engage in unethical behavior to get the sale, or is the salesperson simply having a hard time meeting quota and believes they could do better if the hit the gray area.

In the first case, acquiescing to the employer's demand would create innumerable problems, not the least of which would be the sales person's loss of sleep and a loss of the trust relationship.

In the latter case, there is really only one paradigm by which the sales person should seek guidance. While it seems ridiculously simple, the conversation thus far would lend itself to the understanding that simple it is not. The paradigm is this: Do the Right Thing, Because it is the Right Thing to Do.

The right thing to do will be different to different people, but we all know where the line is in our own experience and value set. Don't cross that line, for your own sake.

It is not the external debate, but rather the internal debate about when to bend the boundaries of our own ethics that presents the greater danger to the individual. Crossing ones own lines leaves one wanting in integrity, and therefore untrustworthy.

Together, let's put the fun back into work!
Belldon Colme
belldoncolme@gmail.com

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Jacques Werth
President, High Probability Selling
Posted on Jan. 17, 2012
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I repeat- in part:

If you have to compromise your ethical standards it's probably because your sales skills are lacking.

Honest, effective salespeople are in demand. If you know how to prospect and sell, it is easy to find a really good sales job - where high ethical standards are never compromised.

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Belldon Colme
Owner, Human Nature Management
Posted on Feb. 2, 2012
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Not sure I agree with you, Jacques. As a standalone statement this is myopic.

You said, "I repeat- in part: If you have to compromise your ethical standards it's probably because your sales skills are lacking."

Robert talked about the construction industry, for example. During the housing bubble, it was common practice for building companies to adjust demands arbitrarily after every tenth home completion. Squeeze budgets, reduce subcontract values by five or 10 percent, expand subcontractor responsibility and scope, shorten the schedule by two days, push the home price by 10 to 15 thousand dollars, and so forth. As an exercise to see exactly where the breaking point was, it was fascinating. If you look around you, we found it.

Part of this process was mortgage brokering. Yep, sales. There is absolutely no doubt that sub-prime mortgage products were being sold irresponsibly. Unethically, even. Some have come to justice for even selling them illegally.

Do you really think there was no mandate from management to engage in questionable behavior and practices?

I would also argue that sales skill was exactly the qualification that led to great success in application of questionable values. Lack of sales skill has always meant being hungry. Great skill may often lead to a person's being put on the front line of the biggest profit center, in this case a questionable place to be.

Construction is most certainly not the only venue where quotas are set arbitrarily, and set just a little beyond where they maybe ought to be. Business for 20 years was moving toward myopic profit, never acknowledging the signs, which were abundant, that the system was about to implode.

For these reasons, this is a timely and valid topic, deserving of a deeper exploration from both points of view-- management and salesperson.

For my part, I believe quotas are often set for the wrong step of the process. Are units sold really all that important, or is the bottom line margin really the important thing? Exploring creative avenues to achieve the real goals might be more productive than arbitrary sales quotas.

Together, let's put the fun back into work!
Belldon Colme
belldoncolme@gmail.com

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Andrew Rudin
Andrew Rudin Replied on Feb. 3, 2012

Jacques--by your reasoning, top performers are more likely to be ethical, and lower performers, or 'top performer wannabee's, are more prone to bending the rules. Yet, there have been plenty of people with 'killer sales skills' who have turned them to malevolent goals. I won't list those people here--you probably can think of more than a few. But a book I read recently, Charlatan--America's Most Dangerous Huckster, by Pope Brock, challenges your assertion. It's the story of John Brinkley, the self-proclaimed doctor, who was unethical to the core. His sales skills and his ability to exploit human frailties might have earned him top honors at some organizations.

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I'm astounded that I'm reading this question and staggered that a person supposedly so well regarded could post it on a public site.
There are no grounds on which anyone should act unethically. Period, full stop, Amen.
Andrew, there are some people who might be dazzled by your PR and might just think you have a valued opinion - the posting of your question suggest that people do act unethically. Your question mat give cause to someone acting unethically in the future.
Delete the post !!

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M Scott Schaffernoth
Chief Tech Coach, Winnovative Technology Consulting, LLC
Posted on Jan. 13, 2012
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Reconciling a problem is not solving it...

This conversation is too fluffy.

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